THE ACCRESCENT™ PODCAST EPISODE 237

Leigh Ann Lindsey (00:02.006)
Okay, well, here we are in another little, I don’t we should call these episodes something unique. A little series, yeah. And I think the best way to start is like sharing the context of what you and I were talking about off air, which is, so for the audience, know, Kelly and I jumped on this call and we had this podcast scheduled and I basically jump on and go, Kelly, I don’t feel like I have anything valuable to say.

Kelly (00:08.32)
We need a series name.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (00:31.764)
Also, I’m like so in the thick of some of this work that I’m doing with the sexual abuse and the trauma and then I start going into what all of that is looking like right now and you were kind of like, okay, pause, pause Leanne. This is worth talking about. And so it was cool to hear that because I do really feel like.

I can’t come on here and just share my experience. have to make it tidy. I don’t know, give some kind of wisdom or epiphany for the audience. And so I think what I was really feeling like is I’m in the thick of it right now and here’s things I’m observing happening in myself, but I don’t have them totally hashed out or solved. But I feel like I need to before I come and present that to anyone.

Kelly (01:25.61)
Yeah, I think any of us, you know, we all kind of feel like that, right? We all want to be offering a piece of advice from the other side, you know, from being beyond the situation. But as I was saying to you, I really feel like people need to hear from each other being in the thick of it. And I think it makes a big difference. It helps us feel a lot less alone in whatever we’re dealing with. And I think just hearing your stories, a reminder that

Leigh Ann Lindsey (01:35.415)
bright.

Kelly (01:54.848)
you know, every, even the voices that we look to in our lives to sort of guide us, go through these things. And it’s nice to hear about it in real time.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (02:02.9)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, so I mean it was nice for me to hear that because I think I said something like So I’m allowed to just share what I’m experiencing and not like make it pretty and you know put a bow on it and tie it up and you were basically just like yeah, that’s still super helpful I think I I think I heard someone call it the messy middle

Kelly (02:11.86)
Yeah.

Kelly (02:22.806)
Yeah, the messy.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (02:23.66)
Like I’m not on the other side of it, but there are interesting, interesting insights and observations, right? Like I’m always kind of in this dual space of there’s the me who’s having the experience. And then there’s the like practitioner Leanne who’s observing herself having the experience and going, wow, this is fascinating. I don’t, I don’t know if that’s healthy or not, but that’s pretty often what’s happening simultaneously.

Kelly (02:44.204)
Yeah, that means perfect sense.

Kelly (02:52.072)
I feel like the messy middle, like we don’t hear from people speaking from that place very often. So I think when that happens, it tends to be very isolating when you’re in it. It starts to leave you feeling like, like you’re feeling, right? I either shouldn’t talk about my experience or no one will resonate with this, but I think it’s precisely because we don’t hear enough people talking from the place of.

I have not figured this out yet. And so I think it’s immensely valuable, even if it helps one person or a few of us to think about our experience differently or to feel less alone in it. That is so crucial, I think in the…

as we all strive to keep going, right? Like these are days where you start to really drag, like, and I know we’ll kind of dig into what you’re experiencing, but it seems like maybe you’re there where it was just like, it’s hard to keep going. You just want an answer. Like you use the word exasperating. And I think that’s a place that we all find ourselves and it can be very lonely.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (03:54.08)
Mm-hmm, yeah, yeah. And I do try to be really conscious and intentional about not bringing content to the world from a place of deep dysregulation. And so I think there was a part of me that was like, I’m really in this. It doesn’t have a nice, neat bow to it. can’t talk about it yet. And at the same time,

I’m not so dysregulated or unanchored by what I’m going through that I can’t show up in my everyday life and that I can’t show up for clients and be so lit up and excited about that and hold the space for them that is required of me. But it’s nice to have it mirrored back or reflected back. They’re like, yeah, Leanne, and you’re also just allowed to share your experience. It doesn’t need to be all tidy.

Kelly (04:45.578)
Yeah, yeah. Okay, so what’s going on? What’s been happening?

Leigh Ann Lindsey (04:48.75)
Well, I think a segue from last conversation we had talked about

the distraction versus, I avoiding this topic out of distraction or am I avoiding it out of discernment? And how there was a little bit of both going on, but ultimately I think it started manifesting more and more as this like psychic burden that I was carrying. And what we talked about last episode or last conversation between you and I, not necessarily the last episode published, but between you and I was…

As soon as I faced that topic head on with my psychotherapist, I got so much energy back. Not necessarily total peace with that topic, but just energy again.

this fog kind of lifted, this heaviness lifted, this lethargy lifted. And so I was on a bit of a high when you and I talked because I was like, my God, I have been feeling so heavy for so long. And to feel that lifted was so, so immense.

And that has remained, I will say, but I think this is some of the nuance of what we’re gonna get into, which is that has remained and there’s different elements that are starting to surface from this work. And so what has been amazing is the energy, in some ways, weirdly, like a kind of lightheartedness I’ve been able to bring back into my life in facing this thing head on. It’s like,

Leigh Ann Lindsey (06:29.622)
Ooh, I’ve sat with the worst possible facet of this abuse that I could sit with and I’m okay. And I made it through that. Like there’s not, you know, there’s not much left in that cupboard that was, you know, had locked away content that I’m afraid to see. And now that I opened it up and looked at it directly,

Kelly (06:32.928)
Yeah.

Kelly (06:38.048)
Yeah, stared it in the face.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (06:52.14)
you know, not much can jump out at me and scare me anymore. So I don’t need to, there’s not all of this psychic energy going towards keeping that content locked away. And so it has been amazing because it’s probably been a full month now, maybe even longer, maybe a month and a half since me and my therapist went really deeply into that content. And…

that feeling of lightness, so much more energy, lightheartedness has really persisted, which has been amazing. Cause that, you know, I think in that episode we talked about how it felt like I was starting my day, like at already only 50 % energy because there was a constant energy consumption happening from this content that I didn’t want to look at. And so now I really do feel like I start the day like, oh,

It’s a fresh day. I feel in some ways just like so much more energy. it makes everything easier when you have all of that energy. And I think it’s worth reiterating because we’re so afraid to look at some of these details and to look at some things in our lives and…

But I see this often with clients where there’s like a heaviness and a lethargy, a depression, an emptiness, that, you know, derealization, that depersonalization of just feeling numb and life’s not real and being able to go, you know, this is what we talked about, right? Like no supplement is going to give me the energy. No supplement is going to be able to replace the energy that this content is stealing from me psychically.

And so the like being able to face it, that might be the thing that clears all of this the quickest. So that is all persisting, but it’s been really interesting to observe myself in the last few weeks. I guess.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (08:50.892)
I well, I’m not totally sure where to start, but what’s coming to my mind right now is, so I meet with my psychotherapist weekly and we’ve been going into different facets of the sexual abuse from my dad and facets of it that I hadn’t worked on or talked about before. So even though I’ve spent time metabolizing that, was like, metabolize these pieces and now I really feel like my psyche was saying like, is time I need to look at

of these other pieces. So with that said, I’ve been having these headaches so regularly again and…

They get really bad. Now, of course, I’m doing due diligence with my physical health care providers to make sure all the boxes are clear over there. And the reality is like, my labs are fantastic. I just did that Pranuvvo scan, which we released the episode on. Like everything was clear. Everything was fine. So there’s it almost is a confirmation that there are emotional components to this.

Kelly (09:55.648)
Yeah, like lucky, that’s all very fortunate, isn’t it? Like you just had this MRI, you know exactly what’s going on in your body. So you can immediately rule out that there’s likely something physical that’s manifesting these headaches.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (09:58.403)
Totally.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (10:09.568)
Yeah, at the very least something super severe that needs to be addressed because, but it’s so interesting, right? And so whenever I have a persistent symptom, I go to some of my different textbooks and resources that talk about emotional contributors to symptoms and what might be beneath it. So of course I had to look up headaches, migraines, and…

Kelly (10:13.185)
Sure.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (10:33.71)
You know, it hits home because the headaches are about, I’ll kind of like scan it here briefly. I’m overwhelmed with my environment and my circumstances. You’re trying to do too many things. You might be caught up in other people’s stress. You might doubt your ability to cope with life and have constant fear of caving in from all the stress.

You feel powerless in some ways. You might be pushing yourself too hard. And then there’s literally a line that says, what are you trying to avoid doing or dealing with? Another emotion to explore is conflict. You might be simultaneously processing quite a lot of different thoughts and plans. So I was just like, okay, well, shit, that all resonates.

Kelly (11:26.506)
Yeah, it feels really resonant with what you’ve been talking about with your psychotherapist.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (11:29.802)
Yeah, yeah. And so something I was sharing with you, Afeyar, before we started was, and I was literally talking to my therapist about this yesterday where I was like, I can feel myself going, this is so much content on so many fronts.

And we’ll get into some of that in more specifics, but the essence of it being, I meet with her weekly and I could feel myself going like, that weekly session isn’t enough to diffuse the intensity of the energy I am holding because of all of this. And I really do think some of that is manifesting in these headaches of.

You know, cause I’m sitting with this content. We’re looking at aspects related to my mom. You know, I shared with you off air, my older brother and I had a therapy session together where I actually met with his therapist for an hour, just her and I. And then he came on the call and the three of us had a session together. And that content is like private and personal to him and I, but

Like, you know, he’s older than me. He has memories that I don’t have that are super disturbing and devastating to sit with. And, you know, the essence of that session was for him and I to see, you know, what’s keeping us apart. We’re wanting to have a better relationship with each other. And so we want to look at…

you know, from your end, from my end, what is contributing to this, this lack of a deep relationship between ourselves? And really the essence of a part of that conversation was how might this sexual abuse be contributing to why it’s hard for you and I to connect with each other?

Leigh Ann Lindsey (13:25.302)
So I’m holding these new memories that he’s bringing to the table. I’m holding the grief around how the abuse from my father affected me and affected him and is now affecting our relationship. I’m holding conflict around my mom and even though in some ways she had nothing to do with this, it’s like, you were the safe parent.

anger coming up around all the people who, know, when we would go visit him over the weekends, like no one ever questioned, no one ever said like, hey, there’s some weird signs here. Are these kids okay? Does someone need to step in? Holding my own devastation with some of my own memories that continue to surface. And so it’s like, okay, on the one hand,

Kelly (14:09.014)
Right?

Leigh Ann Lindsey (14:21.487)
I’m meeting with her weekly, we’re going into this content, I’m doing therapy sessions with my brother. And all of that is so good and so powerful. And to the point I made earlier, there’s this feeling of like, and there is still so much energy around all of this that needs more to be diffused. Does that make sense?

Kelly (14:46.7)
Yeah, it does. Yeah, I’m kind of picturing it like when you’re talking, it was like yeast, sourdough starter like bubbling up over the edge. It’s just like, you know, you like when you keep a lid on the sourdough starter, like nothing happens. But then when you lift the lid and the air comes in, eventually it just starts to like replicate and then it kind of boils over. Right. And

that’s what it feels like you’ve been in the process of right lifting the lid but then in doing so it’s really got to go somewhere and yeah if you keep the lid on if you try to put the lid back on it’s pressure cooker which feels like it’s kind of your brain right now

Leigh Ann Lindsey (15:28.441)
Well, what an apt analogy. God, maybe I should name my sourdough. My psychic sourdough.

Kelly (15:31.948)
You’re sucking sourdough.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (15:39.343)
Freddie, Freddie. What a perfect analogy because that is so often how these headaches feel. It literally feels like there is so much pressure in my entire skull that I wish I could just like plop a tube in there to just diffuse the pressure somehow. So that’s exactly how it feels. Where it leads me to though, cause what I was sitting with yesterday after talking to my therapist about this was also like,

Kelly (15:40.746)
Love.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (16:11.024)
I think it’s worth sharing because sometimes doing the work means symptoms get worse before they get better. Now at the same time, there’s such a deep, like I said, I have this renewed energy, this renewed vitality, this renewed confidence, conviction, anchoring in facing it. So that’s there and…

It’s heavy and there’s grief and it’s devastating and it’s making my head feel like it’s gonna explode. And I need somewhere to go with that. And I guess the point I’m trying to make here is sometimes you can be doing all the work and still having symptoms and that doesn’t necessarily mean you’re doing something wrong or it’s not where you should be headed. Where it does lead me to go is, okay, what is within my power?

to do on the daily basis between major therapy sessions to help diffuse this energy. So that it’s not like, this pressure cooker, this sourdough only gets to release once a week. To me, it seems very clear, like that is not enough. It’s too much.

Kelly (17:13.547)
Right, right.

Kelly (17:18.785)
Right.

Kelly (17:22.838)
Yeah, it’s not working. Yeah.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (17:25.795)
to only go deep once a week, or it’s too much to only sit with once a week. I need to be gently diffusing this throughout the week. And so where my mind goes is, okay, let’s experiment with doing like some EFT, tapping meditations every day. I do my EVOX on myself weekly, and that definitely.

Kelly (17:32.556)
Mm-hmm.

Kelly (17:42.698)
Yeah. It feels somatic, right? Like it feels like it’s something that also needs to be released in the body. You know, the symptom is in the body. So it feels like the body needs to be a part of the release.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (17:55.827)
for sure, yeah, yeah. And interestingly, like when I cry, like when I have a hard cry, that is like what relieves the headache the most. Weirdly.

Kelly (18:05.782)
That’s so pure, honestly. Don’t you think it’s just like your body is just asking, like, can we just let go of this? Can we just really grieve that this happened? Because, you know, you’re taking the time to speak about it with your therapist and we’re talking about it here, but you know, there’s a sense of being somewhat removed from it, right? Like we’re not activating what it was really like for you as a kid to be in that moment. And

Leigh Ann Lindsey (18:10.435)
Yeah.

Kelly (18:36.234)
to just give your body the felt sense of like, you’re allowed to just really, really ache over this. And maybe that’s exactly what you need over a period of time in order to kind of, like you’re saying, diffuse is one of maybe many things that need to start happening. But your body’s really speaking to you really pointedly, it seems, about what it needs next.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (18:42.638)
Mm-hmm.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (19:00.395)
Yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, I said on the one hand, sometimes I get a little exasperated with the headaches because they’ve been so persistent for so long. And I’ve really feel like I’m pursuing every possible option physically, emotionally, spiritually. But at the same time going. Yeah, it’s this isn’t my body betraying me. How can I look at these symptoms with grace and what is here for me in this? And

I think in some ways, and this is again the conscious unconscious disconnect where consciously, truly, anyone in my life today would go, no Leanne seems totally fine. She seems grounded, okay. In so many ways, that’s how I feel in the day to day on a conscious level. And yet my unconscious, I think there’s a ton of deep unconscious turbulence.

Kelly (19:43.776)
Yeah.

Kelly (19:59.617)
Yeah.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (19:59.787)
around being in this topic regularly week after week after week. And that’s the whole point, right? Like our whole point here is to go, how is the unconscious talking to us?

Kelly (20:11.82)
right?

Leigh Ann Lindsey (20:12.959)
even if it doesn’t resonate consciously. So for me, I think that’s where a part of my disconnect has been is on the one hand, I’m going, well, yeah, I mean, I’m doing therapy on this. I’m in it. I’m sitting with it. I’m okay in the day to day. I shouldn’t be having headaches this bad and being able to flip that and go, okay, on a conscious level, I’m okay. I’m grounded. I’m anchored. But these headaches might be reflecting that unconsciously this is

deeply devastating and heavy and overwhelming and I need more than an hour a week to diffuse the intensity of this for me. And in some ways it’s like humbling the conscious ego self to go, hey, ego self, I know you’re good, but all of these signs and symptoms are telling me there’s parts of me that aren’t.

Kelly (20:50.154)
Yeah.

Kelly (20:54.027)
Yeah.

Kelly (20:58.667)
Yeah.

Kelly (21:06.314)
Yeah. And you wouldn’t, you know, you wouldn’t go to a grieving child and say, your sadness can only fit in this one hour this week. Sorry. You get this one hour and the rest of the week, we’ve got stuff to do so you can bottle it up for next week. That’s just not going to work, right? So the, the process is the messiness of it really is because our unconscious motivations are

ask their crying kid saying pick me up and it doesn’t matter if it’s the middle of the night or the middle of a grocery run or whenever it just it’s not it doesn’t care about your schedule it’s just asking to be noticed and tended to.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (21:49.901)
Yeah, yeah, and it’s coming through. I really do think it’s coming through severely with the headaches, the depth of the inner turbulence, and it’s coming through in dreams and like dream themes that are coming up recently. So it’s there, right? It’s like when you know what to look for and how to listen to the unconscious, you do start seeing all of these things.

Kelly (21:56.108)
Truly.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (22:15.107)
But what it makes me think of, right, like the conundrum I felt myself in yesterday that I was talking to my therapist about was…

And maybe this is all abuse, maybe this is all trauma, but what I was sharing with her is it’s so hard because the one thing you want to do is talk to your family and friends about it so that they get it and they understand. And then you can get that comfort. But the reality is like, no one can really get it and understand. so, and this is not like.

putting anything on my family and friends, but it’s rarely comforting to talk to family and friends about this, even though that’s the one thing I wanna do so desperately. And so you feel stuck, right? Even coming back to like this energy that needs to be diffused. I feel a part of me being like, I just wanna talk to my best friend about this or my brother about this, but then also going,

you’re not gonna be able to get what you actually need because it’s so hard for them to be able to understand even if they got explicit details, which I’m not gonna share and they don’t need to hear and that’s traumatizing for them to hear some of that stuff. So it’s interesting and it made me think of my cancer patients and my chronic illness patients where it’s like, I think they feel that very similar thing of

Kelly (23:35.852)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (23:48.791)
I just so deeply want to not be alone in this and have the support of my friends and family, but like no one can really understand the depth of the experience I’m in. And so you might go to someone and they give you something and you’re kind of like, that really didn’t do much for me. If anything, felt maybe even felt dismissive. Now I’m like doubly hurt because I tried to reach out and I didn’t get what I needed and

Kelly (23:56.8)
Yeah.

Kelly (24:09.196)
Right.

Kelly (24:14.699)
Yeah.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (24:15.256)
And it’s like such an interesting conundrum to be in.

Kelly (24:19.264)
Right. So then the validating of your own experience becomes so crucial, right? If the only person who can truly understand how you feel is you, then how do you attend to that? You know, how do you start to turn some of that energy that you spend reaching out to people and trying to explain yourself back towards you and your experience and validating?

what you’ve been through. And maybe that’s where the big cry comes in, you know, or, you know, sitting in doing the EVOX for yourself and seeing what comes up. I’m sure you have other ideas that you would recommend, but those are ways I think that we give ourselves the permission to say like, nobody else on earth may understand exactly what this feels like for me, but I can allow myself to fully feel it.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (25:12.215)
Yeah. Yeah, and I think a part of that, anyone who’s worked with me as a client knows, like the internal imagery and visualizations that we can do. Like as you were talking, what it made me think of is in my mind’s eye imagining, I do get to have a conversation with a sibling or a friend or a loved one.

And in my mind’s eye, I can imagine it going exactly how I want it to go. And I can imagine saying everything I wish I could say to them and then having the perfect response. And that can actually be incredibly acknowledging, validating and soothing. Because I think that part of the reality is like, it’s so hard in real life to talk to, to come to people, right? How you and I are coming right now isn’t, Kelly, I need you to soothe me. It’s, we’re sitting down to talk about this. But when I come,

to a loved one, like I’m really having a hard time with this, I need something from you, that’s really hard for me. And it’s so hard to not be concerned with how my material is going to affect them, right? And so it’s hard for me to turn that off, in fact I haven’t been able to, it’s like…

Kelly (26:21.548)
Sure.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (26:28.609)
I need some support and soothing from you, my loved one, but also I know that this material is super heavy and super disturbing and might impact you. So I’m like simultaneously wanting help, but also trying to make sure you’re okay. And then ultimately I probably just won’t end up bringing that content at all.

Kelly (26:47.008)
saying anything, right? I love what you’re saying about envisioning the loved one or friend with a perfect response though, because I think ultimately, like the people who love us very much would want to give that response, right? We don’t always know how to give it and many of us try our best and don’t always hit the mark, right?

So it’s what they’d want to say if they knew exactly what to say. But instead you kind of buffer them maybe from something that might not be something they can handle. And you also continue to establish that connection with them by imagining it going, you know, you’re reinforcing like I am loved and safe within these circles and maybe this conversation, the way I want to have it isn’t possible, but many conversations are and I’m just going to kind of like embody.

what that would look like or imagine what it would look like for me in this moment. I think that’s really cool.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (27:40.547)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, and I think it’s just worth saying, like, our loved ones aren’t meant to know how to deal with trauma. Our loved ones aren’t meant to know how to respond perfectly when there’s a cancer diagnosis, when there’s been sexual abuse. So we need, I think it’s important that we hold that of like, yeah, they’re not a therapist and they don’t need to be, and I shouldn’t expect them to be. And I am allowed to ask for what I need.

And if it’s, you know, there’s really nothing you can verbally say that’s gonna help me. Can you just, I’m really sad, can you just hold me? Sometimes it’s more of that like somatic, somatic soothing of like, I’m just really down right now and I need to be held for a little bit. Can we sit on the couch and watch a movie and snuggle together? Or it might be, I need you to understand how…

Kelly (28:31.658)
Yeah.

Kelly (28:37.397)
Yeah.

Yeah, great.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (28:46.691)
deeply painful this is for me. But I actually don’t need you to say anything back or do anything. It’s just important that you as a loved one in my life understand and know that I’m really struggling. And I don’t need anything back from that. it’s like setting and it’s a good reminder for me because I think I have felt myself stuck in this like push-pull of, oof.

Kelly (28:59.904)
Yeah.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (29:10.957)
This is a lot, it needs to be diffused, but I can’t take this to anyone because it’ll be too much for them, it’s disturbing, too devastating, too whatever, so I just need to muddle through on my own. it’s like, no Leigh there might be ways that you can diffuse some of this energy with those select few people without needing to open it all up.

Kelly (29:32.076)
sure.

Kelly (29:35.528)
Yeah, yeah, I think that’s such a good reminder. Like there, there is a step we can take towards people towards letting them in even if the topic may have nuance to it. That means it’s not entirely fair to share every part of it.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (29:52.205)
Yeah, totally.

Kelly (29:54.23)
Beautiful.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (29:55.405)
So with that, mean the last thing I will say too is, it’s interesting because there was kind of like a, what’s the word? I’m not sure exactly the right word, a sadness.

a sadness around, okay, I’m back in one of these phases where, or times in life where I know I am gonna have to be facing this material pretty regularly for a while and having hard conversations with my therapist and with family members and with myself. So there was just this part of me of like, ooh, this.

This is gonna be a long journey for a little, like I’m gonna be in it for a while. And I’m trying to like think of an analogy for it. It’s like when you’re at the start of a hike or you’re about to like summit, you know, a mountain and you’re like, okay. I know, I know I need to go up.

Kelly (30:54.516)
Yes.

Kelly (31:01.857)
Yeah.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (31:02.531)
so I can get to the other side and also like, ooh, that’s gonna be a steep climb, a hard climb, a painful climb at times. But ultimately I know this is the path and for my highest good. So I don’t know what that word is. It’s not quite resignation, but it’s just like, okay, this is gonna be heavy for a bit.

Kelly (31:10.262)
Yeah.

Kelly (31:20.96)
Hmm.

You’re reminding me of the quote, devotion is the path to love. And I really just see that like the hiking visual, right? Because I think in that, you know, analogy, we stay devoted to things that are important to us, even if we don’t feel like doing them, right? Because we know they’re for our highest good, as you’re saying. And I think somewhere along the way, devotion turns into love.

And maybe it’s not love for the experience by any means, but I think it becomes love for ourselves getting through it and love for our journeys. No matter where they take us, there is always some sweet spots along the way.

Yeah, I think as we like stay devoted to the path, I think it can have the, it can alchemize, I think, into a loving experience down the line, not to say that it’s in any way easy, or the path that you would have chosen, but it can, I think, bear really sweet fruit. And I think it’s staying on the path, right? Like staying devoted to it. That is the only way that we end up at that point.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (32:28.899)
Yeah.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (32:36.173)
Yeah, well right to that end and I think a good place to close is last conversation between you and I we were talking about distraction versus discernment and I think sometimes it’s loving to give yourself permission to not pick something up and to go I see that there I don’t have capacity for that and vice versa. I think there’s times where it’s loving to go this is heavy.

and it’s gonna be hard and painful and I know this is what needs to be done right now. And so I think last year was a little bit more of one side of that which is like, I am so maxed out this year, this might take me down if I go into this content.

Kelly (33:10.976)
Yeah.

Kelly (33:20.94)
you

Leigh Ann Lindsey (33:24.161)
And then at some point getting the nudges from my psyche of like, okay, it’s time. It’s time to face this and look at this. And I ignored that for a little bit, but now I think the message has shifted to the loving, the most loving thing to do for myself now is to go into this content and start climbing this mountain versus last year was more like a climbing this mountain might kill me. So I’m going to give myself permission to just rest at the base for a bit. And then.

Kelly (33:40.012)
Mm.

Kelly (33:49.952)
Mm-hmm.

Leigh Ann Lindsey (33:53.421)
Now it’s time to start climbing it. So here we are. I know. Thanks everybody. Thanks everyone for holding this and listening. It is messy. It’s not tidy, which it’s hard for me to bring that. And so I hope it’s supportive or expansive in some way. Yep. Thank you so much.

Kelly (33:54.934)
Here we are. Thank you for the update. Thank you. Thanks for meeting us in the messy middle.